A 1960 Speedmaster

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JAFO
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A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

My local auction house (Gildings in Market Harborough) listed a speedmaster, with a price guide of a few hundred pounds.
It's hard to date but I am pretty sure it's pre-moon, and I think it's very early around 1960, but not the very first model. The second I think, with a 321 inside.

The bidding on saleroom is currently £6000.
it should sell sometime after noon tomorrow. I just can't imagine how much it might be worth.

https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auct ... a50106a662
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Amor Vincit Omnia
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by Amor Vincit Omnia »

Looks a bit manky - they might have had a go at cleaning some of the gunk off.

Even so, the auctioneer’s estimate is startlingly low if they know what they’re talking about.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by Bahnstormer_vRS »

^^^^ Its worth what someone is willing to pay for it. :escape: :escape:

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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

There's no gunk. The paint? on the bezel has just pretty well all worn, and it's fading on the dial as well. It looks grey rather than black. It's only 38mm, and no lyre lugs. It's a manual wind, but doesn't say professional. I don't know if it's lumed, but if it is,would it be radium at that age?
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

https://www.timeandwatches.com/p/histor ... aster.html

I think it's the CK2998 in this article, but the dial is slightly different, and according to the seller it's only 38mm.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by rkovars »

If it is a 2998 it could still be a bargain at £6000. Here is a better example at a local auction to me. They are estimating $20-30K. The one listed above looks like it had water in the case to me. I would want to see the movement before laying down any cash.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by monkeymax »

Even in that condition, it is "worth" more than it's currently listed at. The hands sell for a good portion of its current bid - though in better condition than that. The condition is a bit of a shame (rusty hands for example) but I've seen worse in person. At least all pushers and the crown are present.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

I sort of hoped it might ghost in without much attention, but at £6000 (plus 24% commission) it's a bit out of my league, so I mentioned it here. I suspect you wouldn't want to send it in to omega for a service though. :)
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by A1soknownas »

Not sure i'd even give them £60 for it let alone, £6k!

It just looks a mess to me that I wouldn't want to wear or create a museum for it to sit in.

Are the minute and hour hands overlapping or is it missing something?
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

Somebody on WUS thought it was CK2998-62

It just needs the nekkid watchmaker to give it a bit of a fettling.

Here's a picture I took this morning. It's just faded elegance. It has a line running round the inside of the minute/hour track that I've never seen before. Also the bezel is a dot over ninety.
IMG_20210920_115811746~2.jpg
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by rkovars »

If you look at the link I included above you can see that it is a stepped dial. This one is in VERY rough shape.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

rkovars wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:16 pm If you look at the link I included above you can see that it is a stepped dial. This one is in VERY rough shape.
Yes, but they can do wonders, can't they. Good condition variants on chrono24 are priced very high. The cheapest with that handset is 23K. That's a big margin.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by rkovars »

JAFO wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:32 pm
rkovars wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:16 pm If you look at the link I included above you can see that it is a stepped dial. This one is in VERY rough shape.
Yes, but they can do wonders, can't they. Good condition variants on chrono24 are priced very high. The cheapest with that handset is 23K. That's a big margin.
That is true but you could be approaching that cost just to get it running to a high standard. Even at $6K if you have to put in $10K you are closer to $20K than not. And that is if it is in shape to make that happen. There is no guarantee of that. Without looking at the movement you would be taking a big risk. Even if the hands move okay. The Auction estimate on the one in my post is $20K to $30K. I'm guessing it will go closer to $30K if not over. That auction house is fairly popular in my area and it is the first in person auction in over a year so there will be a lot of excitement in the room.

There are a number of 321s in the auction from $5-8K which if realized would be pretty good at that price (they are late 60s). There are a couple of 861s listed at $3-5.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by JAFO »

Well, an interesting and maybe contentious result.

It was sold in the room for £6600.
(Edit. It wasn't sold in the room, because it was on line only, but I think the auctioneers should have realised it was likely to break their limits.)

They have a rule that anyone wanting to bid in excess of £6500 had to get prior approval, and there seemed to be online bidders who were locked out of bidding. If I was the vendor I wouldn't be vey happy with that. I think it just got sold for the first/only bid over £6500.
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Re: A 1960 Speedmaster

Post by rkovars »

Ouch. Not a great result for the seller. I would be upset with the way they handled it as well. Especially since the valuation was incorrect to begin with.
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