Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Technical, movement information, How to's, Why's, service, parts, tool sources and more.
User avatar
gatehealing
Senior Forumgod
Senior Forumgod
Posts: 1595
Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 9:52 pm
CW-watches: 9

Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by gatehealing »

Can anybody point me towards a what tools are used specifically for what types of crystal settings/case backs, hopefully with pictures of the types of settings with the type of tool? I need to learn how to recognize the different types of settings that use different removal tools (and replacements).

Alternatively, I'll list my watches here, and if you know the type of crystal. I'm starting to build up some tools for refurbishing some old watches, but need to remove crystals to really get it done right. I know that Bergeon tends to be the most expensive, but highest quality, but alternative suggestions appreciated.

For Crystal Removal, so far, I know I'll need a claw-type tool, a press type tool, a compression type tool, and some jewelers glue and UV light. For casebacks, it looks like most have small screws, or screw out via threaded caseback (I have one of those rubber balls, but the correct tool would be nice to have as well).

Here's what the watches I have (I'm guessing most crystal and case back types are covered in here):
CWL:
C65
C7 Mki BRGLE
C1
C50 COSC
C10 FLE
C9 Harrison Chrono
C5 Slimline
C20 Lido

Kemmner:
Tonneau

Frederique Constant:
Classics Moonphase

Ball:
Trainmaster Fahrenheit LE

Atlantic:
Worldmaster Art Deco

Steinhart:
Ocean 1 GMT Premium (the new pepsi)

Squale:
Root Beer (I need to go find the spec. model)

Hamilton:
Jazzmaster Spirit of Liberty Chrono, Ltd Ed.

I know it's a big question, but I appreciate any links/books/advice/answers y'all can provide (of course, "never open a watch still under warranty unless you want to void the warranty" and "never trust the water resistance if you open it yourself" and "don't do this, let the pros do it for you" . . . I'll do that for my grails, expensive watches and new watches, but the learning watches, I'm enjoying learning all of this!). By the way, I won't be opening ANY of those up (well, maybe the c65 once its out of warranty because I'll NEVER sell that one!). I don't have my learning watches in my database, so can't list em here, sorry--that just occurred to me).

Warmly
Jon
User avatar
Kip
The Administrator
The Administrator
Posts: 35173
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:45 pm
CW-watches: 150
LE-one: yes
LE-two: yes
LE-three: yes
LE-foura: yes
LE-fourb: yes
LE-five: yes
LE-six: yes
LESeven: yes
Location: New Hampshire, USA

Re: Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by Kip »

Let me preface this by saying I am not endorsing the sellers that the links take you to. I am only using the images as a reference for you. It was faster to do it this way.

I would suggest, based on my own experience, looking at Jules Borel, Otto Frei, Esslinger, Casker or Jewelers Supplies in the USA. There are some other smaller companies, but sometimes they can be hit or miss. You can also find a list of companies on the NAWCC website. I generally prefer tools from Bergeon or Horotec.

Bergeon 4266
In my opinion, this is the best "claw remover" type but does take some practice to work with and not damage a crystal. Th eChines ones on Ebay will work, but a bit more caution must be used as they are not as precise.

Bergeon 5700
This is, without a doubt, the best you will find for overall usage with a case opener. There are some Chinese versions on Ebay that are quite reasonably priced and would probably be okay for limited duty. I would suggest getting the larger size upper vise so you can open many of today's larger watches.

Extra large upper vise This is available separately form Bergeon, although you may be able to get it standard with a new purchase of the 5700.

Bergeon lower vise for 5700
This is must have accessory for the 5700. You cannot imagine what a time saver this is.

There are also some friction case back openers that are attachments for the 5700. They will work on cases that the upper vise won't fit correctly.

Jaxa wrench
You might wonder why you would need one of these with a 5700, but they always seem to come in handy. Best used with a case holder to prevent accidental slippage or place the watch case securely in the 5700 if needed.

As for a crystal press I prefer the Bergeon Pro or BB (owned) press, but one these of is likely to work fine for occasional uses

A UV light such as this works quite efficiently with UV crystal cement.

Take the time to order some catalogs and look through them or online. It will give you a good idea of what is available. You might find others that are more suitable for your needs.

BTW - The 5700 case back pins do not fit CWL watches. You must grind them down a bit to fit correctly. Best to get an extra set of the round pins if you want to do that. The Jaxa wrench will work, but the case back needs protection.

If you want to open Rolex, Breitling and Omega watches there are special tools to do it properly, but you can probably get about 75% of them open with the accessories I mentioned above. There are also several vintage watch brands that require special tools, but most can be opened as above.

I hope that helps you a little.
Kip

"Asylum Administrator"


Visit the CWArchives for everything CW. Historical, specs, manuals and resale. It is all there.
User avatar
gatehealing
Senior Forumgod
Senior Forumgod
Posts: 1595
Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 9:52 pm
CW-watches: 9

Re: Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by gatehealing »

That helps A LOT! Thank you!
Jon
User avatar
gatehealing
Senior Forumgod
Senior Forumgod
Posts: 1595
Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 9:52 pm
CW-watches: 9

Re: Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by gatehealing »

Ok, after looking at the enormous cost of some of the pieces that I'll need, it will clearly need to be done in stages.

Are all of these necessary for cheap watches that I just want to remove the case back, movement (I've learned how to get the stem out on a few kinds of mech and quartzes already as I got case backs off with screwdrivers and that friction ball). It's mainly the crystal that I need to remove now to have only metal case parts to brush/polish with my dremel tool and bigger lathe with the brushes etc.

Please tell me that $1000 vice can be worked around for a bit.
User avatar
Kip
The Administrator
The Administrator
Posts: 35173
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:45 pm
CW-watches: 150
LE-one: yes
LE-two: yes
LE-three: yes
LE-foura: yes
LE-fourb: yes
LE-five: yes
LE-six: yes
LESeven: yes
Location: New Hampshire, USA

Re: Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by Kip »

For case backs you would do well to have a Bergeon 6484 and 4932 snap back openers on hand. You could also cover a lot of ground with this for less money than a 5700. These and the Jaxa wrench and a holder might do you.

Most crystals can be removed with a warm water soak and pressure from the inside. For the acrylic, the claw remover is the best for front loaders.

If you haven't already, An excellent set of screwdrivers is also a must. That should keep you well under your budget.
Kip

"Asylum Administrator"


Visit the CWArchives for everything CW. Historical, specs, manuals and resale. It is all there.
User avatar
gatehealing
Senior Forumgod
Senior Forumgod
Posts: 1595
Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 9:52 pm
CW-watches: 9

Re: Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by gatehealing »

Hey Kip (and anybody else who might know),

Is there a way to know what kind of setting the crystal is in? Ie how will I know if it's glued in vs pressed etc? I must be searching with the wrong terms as I am having difficulty finding an answer to this via google or via searching this forum.

Thanks again for the help! I've ordered a handful of items already. Getting excited!

JOn
User avatar
Kip
The Administrator
The Administrator
Posts: 35173
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:45 pm
CW-watches: 150
LE-one: yes
LE-two: yes
LE-three: yes
LE-foura: yes
LE-fourb: yes
LE-five: yes
LE-six: yes
LESeven: yes
Location: New Hampshire, USA

Re: Different crystal & case back removals: how to

Post by Kip »

Not an easy answer....

Most crystals can be pushed out from the inside by applying gentle pressure from the inside with your thumbs. Even glued ones will come out this way. If not a soaking will usually soften the glue enough.
A loupe can be helpful here, to determine if there is any glue residue.

Newer watches almost always have a gasket. Vintage pieces originally were usually a pressure fit, but most are replacements now and are glued in. Front loaded round ones are almost always pressure fit.

The problem is that there are/have been so many different crystal sizes and that many watchmakers would replace with the closest item they had so glue would be used to secure it. Even today, especially with fashion watches I would see many crystals glued in because the crystals were not available.
Kip

"Asylum Administrator"


Visit the CWArchives for everything CW. Historical, specs, manuals and resale. It is all there.
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post